Clay soil that stays clay soil

[John Walker]

I have been gardening in this one spot in my yard for 15 years.
Originally it resembled potter's clay (it was potter's clay)
I built raised beds and have added compost every spring and fall, mulched, added topsoil, shredded leaf mulch for the winter. It still has the consistency of potter's clay, full of worms but clay nevertheless. It doesn't produce badly, but seed starting (except beans and peas) is a definite no no
Any suggestions
pax
John

[TAR HEEL]

......take 250lbs of white sand and call me in the morning.

[Joy Williams]

have you added peat moss?

[Joy Williams]

oh ya, and sand

[Michelle W. Flannery]

Your soil is already acidic (the nature of clay). Adding sand will loosen the soil, but will make it more acidic.

Have you considered using lime? Dolamitic lime take months to break the soil down. But agricultural lime will work in days. We use dolametic lime here in our Georgia clay, and it makes a marked improvement year after year. You could start with ag lime and then add dolamitic for a longer, slower, continued breakdown.

Clay holds on tight to nutrients, and the plants can practically starve. DL breaks down the clay and allows the nutrients to be released and absorbed by the plants.

The surest way to know what your soil needs is to take a soil test. Your county agent can provide the analysis and report how much lime you need per acre. Compare the pH on the soil analysis report with the ideal pH for the crop you want to grow. Do you have a lot of broomstraw and/or chickweed? These are indicators that your soil could use some lime. However, high organic matter will make some indicator plants less reliable. While calcium or magnesium is essential for plant growth, lime is applied at higher levels that will be used by the plant for the purpose of raising the pH. We use powdered DL and till it into the soil before planting.

Manure, especially chicken manure, will help your soil. Also consider adding things like spoiled flour or spoiled cornmeal (weavels) to the soil. It will provide food for worms and good "wee small beasties" (micro-organisms) who will live, eat, poop, and die in the soil, also improving the clay.

Also, be careful you don't till/dig too deeply. You might bring up the hardpan, which will dry like brick above soil. This hard clay will mix in with your good soil, and you essentially have to start all over again making good soil. Allow the nutrients that you add to filter down into the soil over time, and break the clay down that way.

I found it interesting to discover that at one time farmers literally tasted the soil. They described soil as "sour" when the pH is too low, "bitter" when the pH is too high and "sweet" when the pH is suitable for good crop growth. If you wish to use this method, you will still have to rely on soil test until you have calibrated your taste buds.

Oh, sorry this post is so long. I love to talk when I've got something good to talk about!

[TAR HEEL]

....ok,..put some lyme in there too.you already did the rest.

[TAR HEEL]

..is it lime or lyme,..?

[Penelope]

My experience is that clay soil is sweet, alkaline, rather than acidic.

[Tamra]

My whole yard is limestone and clay. Whenever I want a growing bed, I build a compost pile in that spot. Six months later I plant directly in the finished or almost finished compost. Any big chunks, like sticks are usually sitting on top the pile at this time and are easy to move to a new pile. The worms that are attracted to the compost, move the organic matter down into the clay. In only a few years I have great soil whereever I do this.

I also know a few farmers that swear by planting daikon radish for breaking up clay.

[TAR HEEL]

....what about the lime/lyme and sand?he already did all that Tam.

[John Walker]

I'm in KY home of mammoth cave........Adding lime? ;)

I think the worms are definitely moving the organic matter into the clay about 6 ft under.

Thanks for the answers, I'm still perplexed that adding compost over 15 years 2 a year has not broken down the clay.
as to adding sand, I have always been told not to because it forms concrete.... Maybe there are different sands out there..
pax
John

[Ian]

Hi John,
My garden is clay on limestone, which sounds very similar to yours.
I have made about 19 vegetable beds this year by tilling in sand, compost and fresh grass cuttings. The fresh grass cuttings went in basically because I had lots of grass and it was a ready resource.
I did this back in February of this year and now have workable soil.... It is far from perfect and hopeless for seeds but I am able to plant fairly small seedlings. I did a soil test which showed the ph to be very high, which is hardly surprising if you look at the number of lorries passing my gate filled to the brim with bright white stone from the quarry next door....

[Steph]

Hi John,

Could you explain/expand a bit on what you mean by "breaking down the clay".

Working in raised beds, it seems to me that your biggest problem with the clay would be drainage. I garden in KY in raised beds--my pH ran as high as 7.9 in some areas. I agree that adding lime seems strange in our limestone rich region. Have you tried adding sulfur, sawdust, composted leaves, wood chips, cottonseed meal, leaf mold or peat moss? I do not practice a great deal of tillage as we add our homemade compost throughout the growing season--often using it as a mulch to control moisture in the beds and working it in as crops are removed and replanted.

Again I would like to better understand, "breaking down the clay". I understand soil in layers and I am positive our clay runs deep--so deep and heavy that it often is the most beautiful blue and resistant to change. Is a drainage a problem for you?